"Send a Message" Function on LCR

Discussions about the Leader and Clerk Resources on lds.org.
scgallafent
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Re: "Send a Message" Function on LCR

Postby scgallafent » Thu Sep 10, 2015 8:22 am

mevans wrote:I sent an email to the Bishopric. I'm in the Bishopric email list. I received two copies to the same email address; however, the capitalization of the email is different, so I don't know if it thinks they're different email addresses? (In my LDS Account email address, it's all lower case; In my Membership email address, it's mixed case, but the same address.)

The capitalization of the email would make a difference. I'll get it logged so that it can be addressed.

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Re: "Send a Message" Function on LCR

Postby russellhltn » Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:00 am

scgallafent wrote:The capitalization of the email would make a difference.

Something to keep in mind: RFC5321
The local-part of a mailbox MUST BE treated as case sensitive. Therefore, SMTP implementations MUST take care to preserve the case of mailbox local-parts. In particular, for some hosts, the user "smith" is different from the user "Smith". However, exploiting the case sensitivity of mailbox local-parts impedes interoperability and is discouraged.

Depending on how the filtering works, that could be an issue. If you're just checking that two emails from a one member are the same - that's OK. But if you're checking between users, I'm not sure as a case-insensitive comparison is a good idea.
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scgallafent
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Re: "Send a Message" Function on LCR

Postby scgallafent » Thu Sep 10, 2015 12:53 pm

russellhltn wrote:Something to keep in mind: RFC5321
The local-part of a mailbox MUST BE treated as case sensitive. Therefore, SMTP implementations MUST take care to preserve the case of mailbox local-parts. In particular, for some hosts, the user "smith" is different from the user "Smith". However, exploiting the case sensitivity of mailbox local-parts impedes interoperability and is discouraged.

Depending on how the filtering works, that could be an issue. If you're just checking that two emails from a one member are the same - that's OK. But if you're checking between users, I'm not sure as a case-insensitive comparison is a good idea.

RFC 5321 has several relevant items:
The local-part of a mailbox MUST BE treated as case sensitive.

Local-part = Dot-string / Quoted-string
; MAY be case-sensitive

However, exploiting the case sensitivity of mailbox local-parts impedes interoperability and is discouraged.

While the above definition for Local-part is relatively permissive, for maximum interoperability, a host that expects to receive mail SHOULD avoid defining mailboxes where the Local-part requires (or uses) the Quoted-string form or where the Local-part is case-sensitive.

So the RFC requires (MUST BE) that the local-part be case-sensitive, does not require (MAY) that it be case-sensitive, discourages depending on case-sensitivity, and says that you should avoid implementations where the local-part is case-sensitive -- all in the same document.

In practice, I don't know of any modern email providers that implement case-sensitive email addresses. The general rule in implementation is exactly the opposite -- most providers will accept any mix of upper- and lowercase characters. Essentially, case-insensitive email addresses have become the standard, even though the RFC specifies that they may be case-sensitive.

From an implementation standpoint, we have the choice of strictly enforcing the RFC and forcing mevans to fix whichever one of his email addresses is not "correct" (if he can even figure out why he's getting two copies of the message) or we can accept the de facto standard at the risk of a failure in the unlikely case that there are two Church members in the same scope whose email addresses differ only in their capitalization.

Restricting the case-insensitive check to a single member would reduce the already very small risk of failure in the sender's case, but still leaves open the larger case where members share an email address. According to the RFC, billsuzysmith@example.com and BillSuzySmith@example.com are different email addresses, but they both likely end up in the same place. If Bill uses the first version and Suzy uses the second version, a case-insensitive comparison for a single member will still result in them getting two copies of the message. I just did a quick check of my ward's records and there are three email address pairs like this where the same address (except for capitalization) is used for two different people.

russellhltn
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Re: "Send a Message" Function on LCR

Postby russellhltn » Thu Sep 10, 2015 1:23 pm

scgallafent wrote:So the RFC requires (MUST BE) that the local-part be case-sensitive, does not require (MAY) that it be case-sensitive, discourages depending on case-sensitivity, and says that you should avoid implementations where the local-part is case-sensitive -- all in the same document.

My best guess is it's an old standard (case-sensitive) that turned out to be a bad idea. So it's discouraged, but it remains as part of the standard since there still might be servers out there that use it. You can quickly run into "political" situations trying to resolve it. So at some level, it's best if it's supported. (In this case, we can store the emails in mixed case.)


scgallafent wrote:In practice, I don't know of any modern email providers that implement case-sensitive email addresses.

Off hand, I don't know either. But that's not to say there aren't any. Especially if we're talking world-wide. Thus I thought it worth discussion. It comes down to which is the bigger issue. Maybe not so much in number of people affected, but the seriousness of it. That's kind of a toss up. Which is worse, getting two emails because of what a member entered, or someone not getting them though no fault of their own?


And then you have Google which ignores periods. So, homerjsimpson@gmail.com is the same as Homer.J.Simpson@gmail.com. But I think he's just going to have to accept getting two emails. D'oh! :)
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kellymab
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Re: "Send a Message" Function on LCR

Postby kellymab » Thu Sep 10, 2015 1:54 pm

I checked with our executive secretary, he had two seperate emails listed. One for his LDS account and another on his membership record. He has since changed them to match.

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Re: "Send a Message" Function on LCR

Postby mevans » Thu Sep 10, 2015 9:31 pm

That's an interesting discussion on on RFC 5321. I never realized that emails could be case sensitive. I also have never seen a system where it was case sensitive.

It probably was a standard from long ago and it might break things if they change it, so they don't. Much of the internet came from Unix systems where case sensitivity is important. DOS and Windows trained us that case sensitivity isn't important.

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Re: "Send a Message" Function on LCR

Postby zaneclark » Mon Sep 14, 2015 6:40 am

I have been using the Directory with the "cut and paste" routine to send messages to the ward but decided to use the application in LCR today.... It is much easier to use, but I miss the ability to tweak the text with bold, colors, etc... Is there any way to do this in LCR other than using HTML?

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Re: "Send a Message" Function on LCR

Postby mevans » Mon Sep 14, 2015 6:58 am

zaneclark wrote:I have been using the Directory with the "cut and paste" routine to send messages to the ward but decided to use the application in LCR today.... It is much easier to use, but I miss the ability to tweak the text with bold, colors, etc... Is there any way to do this in LCR other than using HTML?


Does the new "Send a Message" allow HTML? I haven't tried that yet.

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Re: "Send a Message" Function on LCR

Postby jonesrk » Mon Sep 14, 2015 7:37 am

mevans wrote:
zaneclark wrote:I have been using the Directory with the "cut and paste" routine to send messages to the ward but decided to use the application in LCR today.... It is much easier to use, but I miss the ability to tweak the text with bold, colors, etc... Is there any way to do this in LCR other than using HTML?


Does the new "Send a Message" allow HTML? I haven't tried that yet.

It doesn't. I tried that in a sample message when I first saw the new version.
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Re: "Send a Message" Function on LCR

Postby zaneclark » Mon Sep 14, 2015 7:54 am

jonesrk wrote:
mevans wrote:
zaneclark wrote:I have been using the Directory with the "cut and paste" routine to send messages to the ward but decided to use the application in LCR today.... It is much easier to use, but I miss the ability to tweak the text with bold, colors, etc... Is there any way to do this in LCR other than using HTML?


Does the new "Send a Message" allow HTML? I haven't tried that yet.

It doesn't. I tried that in a sample message when I first saw the new version.


Yup...tried it just now and no formatting with HTML... Too bad, but I will probably continue to use LCR instead of the Directory as it is much simpler....


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