LDS tools Android production version

Discussions around the Android version of the Member Tools application
elderlarryhawkes
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Postby elderlarryhawkes » Wed Jan 19, 2011 10:36 am

aebrown wrote:There's definitely some preference involved. I guarantee I can write down an MRN faster from a one-page piece of paper than you can look up a member on a handheld and then write down the number. But that assumes that I have the paper and that you have your handheld in hand. As I said before, a variety of ways to get the information is good.

:DI like the guarantee:).
On the other hand, have you found a way to get MLS to print just Names and MRNs all on one page or even just 2 pages. That would really be nice rather than the 12 page list that I could only get MLS to print with MRNs.

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aebrown
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Postby aebrown » Wed Jan 19, 2011 10:44 am

elderlarryhawkes wrote::DI like the guarantee:).
On the other hand, have you found a way to get MLS to print just Names and MRNs all on one page or even just 2 pages. That would really be nice rather than the 12 page list that I could only get MLS to print with MRNs.


I generated a custom report with names and MRNs, then copied the results to a spreadsheet, where I could put three columns per page in a small but reasonable font. Some wards fit on one page, and others may take front and back, but it can be done pretty compactly.
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Postby RossEvans » Wed Jan 19, 2011 10:55 am

aebrown wrote:I generated a custom report with names and MRNs, then copied the results to a spreadsheet, where I could put three columns per page in a small but reasonable font. Some wards fit on one page, and others may take front and back, but it can be done pretty compactly.


From a practical standpoint I'm glad that all the workarounds to export MRNs have not yet been shut down. But I fail to see how such a custom report exported to a spreadsheet is inherently more secure than just including the MRN in the complete export file Membership.csv, which at least requires Administrator privilege to generate in MLS. If the security rationale is to keep the exported MRN out of portable export CSV files possesed by leaders and clerks, I should think that same rationale might constrain such custom reports, too. This may just be a hole that hasn't been closed yet, but will be.

elderlarryhawkes
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Postby elderlarryhawkes » Wed Jan 19, 2011 10:58 am

aebrown wrote:I generated a custom report with names and MRNs, then copied the results to a spreadsheet, where I could put three columns per page in a small but reasonable font. Some wards fit on one page, and others may take front and back, but it can be done pretty compactly.


Thanks, I will give that a try. And you know I can't help asking if there is a guarantee that this is faster too.;)

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aebrown
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Postby aebrown » Wed Jan 19, 2011 11:01 am

RossEvans wrote:From a practical standpoint I'm glad that all the workarounds to export MRNs have not yet been shut down. But I fail to see how such a custom report exported to a spreadsheet is inherently more secure than just including the MRN in the complete export file Membership.csv, which at least requires Administrator privilege to generate in MLS. If the security rationale is to keep the exported MRN out of portable export CSV files possesed by leaders and clerks, I should think that same rationale might constrain such custom reports, too. This may just be a hole that hasn't been closed yet, but will be.


Custom reports that include the MRN cannot be run by users with only organizational rights -- you have to have at least View Membership rights in order to run such a report.
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russellhltn
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Postby russellhltn » Wed Jan 19, 2011 11:18 am

aebrown wrote:Actually, that's extremely common in the world of employment. Access to internal systems often requires an employee ID of some kind, which is issued by the company to the individual. That is fairly analogous to what the Church does.


Thank you, I was trying to come up with a business world analogy. You wouldn't expect to walk up to a HR manager in the hallway and ask "what's my employee number" and get an immediate answer. It's far more likely you'll hear "It's in the computer - I'll have to look it up when I'm at my desk."

Can anyone come up with a business world analogy of what's being requested - sensitive information stored in a smart phone?
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RossEvans
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Postby RossEvans » Wed Jan 19, 2011 11:46 am

aebrown wrote:Custom reports that include the MRN cannot be run by users with only organizational rights -- you have to have at least View Membership rights in order to run such a report.


Yes, I know. But that is still a lower level of privilege than is required to export Membership.csv. IIRC, the MLS user executing the Membership.csv export must have rights to view temple-recommend data. Further, if that user is not an Administrator, he must get an Administrator to countersign the export. Since this elevated level of privilege apparently is now deemed too low to regulate the export of MRNs in the Membership.csv file, it seems that to be consistent with this principle a greater level of privilege, not a lower one, would also be needed for other MRN exports. (Note the the new restriction is not on who can view the MRN, but on whether it can be exported tp a file.) So it may be that the continued permitting of exported MRNs from a custom report is just a hole that has not yet been closed.

elderlarryhawkes
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Postby elderlarryhawkes » Wed Jan 19, 2011 12:04 pm

RussellHltn wrote:Thank you, I was trying to come up with a business world analogy. You wouldn't expect to walk up to a HR manager in the hallway and ask "what's my employee number" and get an immediate answer. It's far more likely you'll hear "It's in the computer - I'll have to look it up when I'm at my desk."

Can anyone come up with a business world analogy of what's being requested - sensitive information stored in a smart phone?


Is there a policy that says we are not supposed to keep a printed paper document with us that has MRNs on it? Since a paper document is still easily generated and possibly converted to a spread sheet or PDF as mentioned, what's the difference?

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Postby russellhltn » Wed Jan 19, 2011 1:24 pm

elderlarryhawkes wrote:Is there a policy that says we are not supposed to keep a printed paper document with us that has MRNs on it?


I know of no such policy. The closest I know is that such information is not to lie around the office unsecured.

elderlarryhawkes wrote:Since a paper document is still easily generated and possibly converted to a spread sheet or PDF as mentioned, what's the difference?


It seems to me that on a grand scale, the likelihood of such a document being created and lost is lower then the probably of a member of the bishopric losing their smart phone. Policy tends to plug the big holes and not every possible hole.
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Postby lajackson » Wed Jan 19, 2011 1:26 pm

elderlarryhawkes wrote:Is there a policy that says we are not supposed to keep a printed paper document with us that has MRNs on it? Since a paper document is still easily generated and possibly converted to a spread sheet or PDF as mentioned, what's the difference?


The policy is that membership record information is to be kept confidential.

Personally, I am still struggling to understand why someone generally would need to have this list and carry it around. For the average member, the MRN is not even needed to set up an LDSAccount, or to retrieve a lost password.

The only time I can think of that the MRN is needed is when a temple recommend is issued for the first time, and when renewed for those one or three TRs still floating around in our stake with the wrong MRN on them.

Other than that, I think the information should be protected.

In other countries, criminal laws are involved. In the U.S., we are still catching up to that standard.


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