Approved online tracking programs

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russellhltn
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Postby russellhltn » Sun Sep 14, 2008 1:48 pm

daddy-o wrote:In the thread I referenced I mentioned Public Records law. If you are not familiar with Public Record law it means that incorporating the names of adults, which is public record, is similar to fair use.


Just a couple of points:

While the information of the head of household may be public information, the association with the church may not. So for the church to publish it, it could be a privacy violation because it would be publishing the fact that this person is a member. It should be noted with LUWS, you can not see the list of households unless you login to your ward. And that option is only extended to members of that area.

Secondly is the sticky distinction between "public" and "published". For many years some information has been public in the sense that anyone can go down to the local courthouse or city hall and ask for it. It's always been there, but few bother to go and do it. But when you place that same information on a website, it's potentially available for anyone, anywhere, anytime to come look and gawk at it or mine it for details. Things like divorce filings, bankruptcies, most anything going to court. At this point I it may not be a legal problem, but it is causing a great deal of concern and discussion and so the laws are changing and becoming more restrictive.

Standard disclaimers apply: IANAL
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RossEvans
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Postby RossEvans » Sun Sep 14, 2008 2:02 pm

daddy-o wrote: I think we are suffering from different levels of familiarity with the subject matter. I have had direct conversations with CHQ Bishop and Clerk support on this. I even referenced the person I spoke with in the post.


With respect, daddy-o, you might note that not only Ibut some others commentingon that other thread do not think your paraphrased report of a conversation you had with a staffer in Clerk Support settles this as binding policy for the whole Church.

I will continue to follow my own common-sense interpretation based in large part on guidance from respected administrators or moderators on this forum-- and more important, that of my Bishop -- that these export files are there for us to use responsibly in our callings, of course under password protection. And my Bishop, like many others, will probably continue to use these export files to populate third-party helper applications such as Ward Tools and MLS Companion, or their own spreadsheets, or homegrown applications. In fact, I took my routine data dump this afternoon and plan to use it at home this week on two projects for our leadership.

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ccarter
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Offline Program

Postby ccarter » Sun Sep 14, 2008 4:31 pm

Ok, with all of the issues about entering data online. Are there any "offline" programs that I could download to my computer and use?

I am guessing that if I had a stand alone program to enter data and track advancement in DTG and Scouting, I would not have so many issues with private and public data.

Does anyone know of a program I can install locally that will do the same thing as the websites are offering?

kennethjorgensen
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DTG offline solutions

Postby kennethjorgensen » Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:31 am

clintcarter@gmail.com wrote:Ok, with all of the issues about entering data online. Are there any "offline" programs that I could download to my computer and use?

I am guessing that if I had a stand alone program to enter data and track advancement in DTG and Scouting, I would not have so many issues with private and public data.

Does anyone know of a program I can install locally that will do the same thing as the websites are offering?


I like your cautious take on this by exploring to tread on safer ground. There can easily be too many different opinions and uncertain issues associated with the other ways.

As for offline applications etc I too would also welcome the all-singing all-dancing version and its very possible I might try this myself if there is nothing else out there.

There seems to be plenty stuff people have done if you look at places like http://www.dutytogod.com and http://dtgtracker.com but much of it I personally think does the same job as the church's own tracking sheet (http://www.lds.org/pa/images/ym/trackingsheet.pdf).

What I personally missed in all these is the ability to know if and how much a Young Man is behind with his Duty To God progress and how often he would have to complete a goal in order to still achieve them all by the time he will advance to the next office. That is the reason why we created our own spreadsheet and used that in connection with the church's own tracking sheet.

You are welcome to have a copy of that spreadsheet if you want or if you find a better spreadsheet on the above sites then maybe you can alter them to include the missing checks. Btw, our sheet is DTG only, just havent had time yet to include Scouts and YW and Primary's Faith in God yet.

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ccarter
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DTG requirements

Postby ccarter » Tue Sep 16, 2008 2:24 pm

dkjorgi wrote:There seems to be plenty stuff people have done if you look at places like http://www.dutytogod.com and http://dtgtracker.com but much of it I personally think does the same job as the church's own tracking sheet (http://www.lds.org/pa/images/ym/trackingsheet.pdf).


I am currently using an Excel spreadsheet to track all of the DTG requirements for our Young Men in our ward. I haven't seen DTGtracker yet so I'll download it and see what it will do for me.

thanks

blmcewan-p40
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Another slant both ways

Postby blmcewan-p40 » Tue Sep 16, 2008 3:18 pm

Just glanced over this thread and the various responses. Didn't look like anyone mentioned the fact that just about anyone can login to their own ward website and download Membership and Calendar information on their own. Yes, I know it's not the same amount of detail as MLS, but. . .

Once downloaded by anyone, it's potentially at risk!! Especially if their computer is not as hacker-safe in a 24/7 world we live.

Now on the otherhand as I've served in various callings, I've used the MLS PDA-intended exports for my own organizations use and the use of the entire ward under the direction of Bishop etc. It had benefitted me and other leaders quite well, as MLS is lacking in a lot of ways of useful information.

Yes, I do use password security on my iPhone/PDA, computers, USB thumb drives etc. But if the government, UofU medical, and many other responsible organizations can be hacked--why would CHQ or any of the rest of individuals be safe?? Including wards/stake now being given permission to have broadband access to the buildings. Hmmmmmm

Once again instead of forbidding it or leaving it to the local leaders, why not embrace it and build the features needed or separate apps from CHQ. Opensource the development and create mechanisms that allow for feedback and features to be added etc.

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Can the church modify the Duty to God?

Postby ksroberts » Wed Mar 31, 2010 7:52 pm

There are too many disconnects between Scouting requirements and Duty to God.

It takes about a couple years for a leader to understand how the two program requirements blend together and to be effective in helping the kids pass off requirements.

By time you figure out the program, it's time to turn the calling over to someone new.

I would like to see the church carefully anaylize the Scout and D2G programs so that they can live happily together. Scout leaders should not feel pressured into buying extra software or into using software that can be difficult to use.

The success of the D2G and Scouting programs should not be limited to the experienced or tech-savvy leaders.

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Postby geek » Thu Apr 01, 2010 1:04 pm

riverton wrote:There are too many disconnects between Scouting requirements and Duty to God.

It takes about a couple years for a leader to understand how the two program requirements blend together and to be effective in helping the kids pass off requirements.

By time you figure out the program, it's time to turn the calling over to someone new.

I would like to see the church carefully anaylize the Scout and D2G programs so that they can live happily together. Scout leaders should not feel pressured into buying extra software or into using software that can be difficult to use.

The success of the D2G and Scouting programs should not be limited to the experienced or tech-savvy leaders.


You'd be surprised at how many parents have already done this work on their own to track their own children's progress (D2G and Eagle for boys, YWPP for girls). Ask around in your ward and see who has done it and isn't admitting it publicly. There are a *lot* of parents who aren't waiting for the Scout, YW, or YM leaders to track the progress.

As far as the original concerns about tracking my children on an online site, I'll agreement with the sentiment that a leader had better get my approval first (even though she's already got email and web domains and an online presence, I want to be able to know who in the ward is storing her information).
Former membership clerk under 3 bishops, now on 2nd stint as executive secretary. Can I go back to teaching priesthood now?

ksroberts
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Duty to God / Scout Tracking

Postby ksroberts » Thu Apr 01, 2010 5:56 pm

You are correct. I've seen a zillion different tracking methods around the internet.

For myself, I created an Excel versoin using formulas to automatically populate appropriate fields -- and use my iTouch to quickly view the progress of our scouts/deacons.

However, none of the tracking systems is adequately meeting the needs - -that's why someone is always trying to re-invent tracking methods. Our Stake experimented with ScoutSoft (not intuitive or user friendly). I know another stake in Utah county is experimenting with another program.

It doesn't have to be this tough. Duty to God and Scout requirements should more closely mirror each other.

ksroberts
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Duty to God and Scout Tracking

Postby ksroberts » Sat Apr 03, 2010 8:56 pm

Ask and you shall receive -- quickly.

Today's conference announcement about the new Duty to God program removes my Scout vs D2G tracking concerns.

The LDS website states:

[size=84][font=PalatinoldsLat-Roman]"The new program does not[/font][/SIZE][font=PalatinoldsLat-Roman][size=84]overlap or compete with Scouting." [/SIZE][/font]


[font=PalatinoldsLat-Roman][size=84]Nice! :cool:[/SIZE][/font]


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