Records sent to my ward with no address?

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russellhltn
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Re: Records sent to my ward with no address?

Postby russellhltn » Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:33 pm

All I can say is that I'll bet a whole bunch of people are going to wish they kept their notes after sending them out the first time. Could save a lot of re-work.
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RossEvans
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Re: Records sent to my ward with no address?

Postby RossEvans » Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:45 pm

lajackson wrote:
RossEvans wrote:I think the immediate first step, as it is with all questionable records that arrive from the Address Unknown heap in Salt Lake, is to mail to those addresses (if present at all) with Return Service Requested and see if a forwarding address pops up.

That is actually step two of the eight-step process to be followed, according to the June 21, 2013 Notice. jaj78 posted a copy of the instructions earlier in this topic.


Yes, I did notice that. Apparently the literal instructions oblige the local priesthood to knock on each door and mail to each household that does have an address listed. In our case, that is 17 out of the 20.

I'm sure our clerk at the time the records were shipped out the first time -- you know him well :) -- would not have sent these households to Address Unknown without vetting them first. And our practice would have mailed to these addresses at least annually. So now, a year or more later, I am quite sure that following the first two steps in the instructions will not bear fruit. In our ward we can be pretty sure these families no longer live at these addresses, and have not for some time. The whole exercise is a long-shot attempt to find out where they really live.

Given that, I suggest that bishoprics and clerks might want to segregate these quarterly batches of 20 from some actions normally accorded actual new move-ins -- who presumptively do live at the listed addresses. For example, I propose to exclude these names from our fast-offering routes. (Our normal practice prioritizes new move-ins at the top of that rotation.)
Last edited by RossEvans on Wed Jul 03, 2013 3:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Records sent to my ward with no address?

Postby lajackson » Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:58 pm

RossEvans wrote:I'm sure our clerk at the time the records were shipped out the first time -- you know him well :) -- would not have sent these households to Address Unknown without vetting them first.

Indeed, I do know him. Would that any bishop be so fortunate.
RossEvans wrote:I suggest that bishoprics and clerks might want to segregate these quarterly batches of 20 from some actions normally accorded actual new move-ins --

I agree. I would consider it a verification that the work was done properly before the records were sent out the first time.

kirtkennedy
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Re: Records sent to my ward with no address?

Postby kirtkennedy » Fri Jul 05, 2013 10:44 pm

How do you deal with someone who is a member and is moving out of the ward, but because they are hostile to the Church, refuses to give their new address or any contact information. They want to be "lost"...no contact with the Church.

Gary_Miller
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Re: Records sent to my ward with no address?

Postby Gary_Miller » Fri Jul 05, 2013 11:07 pm

kirtkennedy wrote:How do you deal with someone who is a member and is moving out of the ward, but because they are hostile to the Church, refuses to give their new address or any contact information. They want to be "lost"...no contact with the Church.

You run the steps to see what you can turn up on your own even if its just the town. If you find nothing you send them to CHQ with a note about whats happening and were you think they are. There is a place for the notes right on the move out form in MLS.

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Re: Records sent to my ward with no address?

Postby jaj78 » Mon Jul 08, 2013 6:30 am

For our ward, I have found the most productive sources to be a combination of:

*Google
*WhitePages.com
*Facebook
*Local Property records online (public)

Between the four of those, you uncover some significant clues about where people have gone. Sifting through current and out-dated information is sometimes challenging, but it's not too bad.
I keep a spreadsheet with the steps from post #2 with a line for each individual, and as each step is completed, I date it. If nothing turns up, then we are fully justified to send back to CHQ.

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Re: Records sent to my ward with no address?

Postby RossEvans » Mon Jul 08, 2013 7:12 am

jaj78 wrote:For our ward, I have found the most productive sources to be a combination of:
...
*WhitePages.com
...


I find WhitePages.com to be worse than useless. It is based on fuzzy search algorithms that favor reporting wrong information over returning no hits. For example, I just looked up myself on that site and give my city and state. It returned two possible addresses for me. Both are utterly wrong. (I have not had a listed landline for years.)

Some other so-called "white pages" search sites, based on landline telephone directories of listed numbers, have a couple of serious weaknesses. First, fewer and fewer people have landlines. Second, white-page phone directories typically do not include apartment numbers. They just show the street address of the apartment complex.

In our ward we have multiple mystery households with missing apartment numbers, probably the result of some "helpful" clerks somewhere using white-page searches and shipping the records to us. Without an apartment number, such a street address is useless. No one can visit these addresses, and USPS will never report a forwarding address for a mailing because the mailer started without complete addresses to look up. The truncated address thus becomes a permanent dead end, from which it probably cannot be rescued -- a failure worse than sending it to the Address Unknown file. But for each of them, some clerk somewhere got the lost family off his ward's books, so there was the illusion of success.

To help trap for missing-apartment errors, anyone using a white-pages search result should follow up by submitting the retrieved address to the USPS Zip validation site. That will show if an aparment number is missing or if the address is otherwise undeliverable.

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sbradshaw
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Re: Records sent to my ward with no address?

Postby sbradshaw » Thu Jul 18, 2013 12:51 am

jaj78 wrote:For our ward, I have found the most productive sources to be a combination of:

...
*Facebook
...


Facebook is very useful. If you have an email address you can find the profile of someone on Facebook instantly. With just a name, there could be some digging. Once you find their profile, depending on their privacy settings, you can look for clues that tell if they still live in the same city, at least, based on what they post. You can send them a message or sometimes find other phone numbers or email addresses to contact them. Additionally, you can see if they are Facebook friends with people you know who may be able to get information you can't and help you in your search.

Facebook is useful for cleaning out the lost and found, too. In my YSA stake clerks' office in Provo we had several sets of scriptures, small hymnbooks, and a missionary journal that had been sitting there for years. I was able to look up the people on Facebook from the names engraved on the scriptures and looked for other clues, bookmarks, language notes, etc. to identify the right person. For example, an LDS person in Provo with the correct last name, who according to Facebook attended BYU and teaches Korean at the MTC got his mission journal with Korean notes back. I was also able to locate another person via Facebook and just the name on the scriptures by noting that he had several mutual friends still in the stake... Detective work is fun! :)

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Re: Records sent to my ward with no address?

Postby jerryarnoldblauer » Thu Jul 18, 2013 9:24 pm

I am the Membership Clerk for a dying Ward. We have approximately 85% Inactivity. Most of the strong families have moved out in droves. We no longe have an Elder's Quorum Presidency. Our Home Teaching is well below 10%. We rarely have Ward Council Meetings anymore and I am not allowed to participate, as the Bishopric thinks matters are too confidential for my ears, although I have been told of and have seen much in confidendtial matters. So, briefing the Ward Council, not to mention getting their help is impossible. Our office telephone has been permanently cut off and I was told that a telephone is no longer a priority, even though that is a major tool I have used for years to communicate with Bishopric's and Member's concerning lost, or inactive Members in our Ward.

Is there anyone who can tell me what I can do to get the help and resources I need?

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Re: Records sent to my ward with no address?

Postby lajackson » Fri Jul 19, 2013 11:16 am

jerryarnoldblauer wrote:So, briefing the Ward Council, not to mention getting their help is impossible. . . .

Is there anyone who can tell me what I can do to get the help and resources I need?

You certainly have a challenge.

Based on what you have said, your Ward Clerk is your resource. He attends the Ward Council and can relay important messages and ask the bishop to make assignments.


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