Multicast on Meetinghouse network

Discussions about Internet service providers (ISPs), the Meetinghouse Firewall, wired and wireless networking, usage, management, and support of Meetinghouse Internet
danpass
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Re: Multicast on Meetinghouse network

Postby danpass » Tue Mar 05, 2013 6:55 pm

davelane wrote:In our Stake we have had issues with running out of IP address, which we solved by requesting additional addresses from GSC. However a whole new problem emerged, nothing is that easy. We have several TV's that are connected with AppleTV devices, now sometimes users can't find them with their IOS or Android devices. When GSC adds IP addresses they do it in three different subnets and unless DHCP assigns the two devices on the same subnet the cannot see each other. I contacted GSC and asked if we could get a subnet that would accomodate 256 IP addresses, they were somewhat unsympathetic to the problem. The tech stated that they only would configure the firewalls this way and our only option would be to reset the firewall and go back to the default IP address range. We do have a roboust internet connection that would easily handle the traffic, the biggest challenge is LDS.Org is often unavailable on Sundays due to what I would assume is a great volume of traffic.To work arround that issue we have a media server that we have cached all the church video content on so that teachers,Bishoprics etc. can access the content when lds.org in unavailable. Unfortunatly the subnet issue limits the effectiveness of the server. Any work arround suggestions would be appreciated. This problem is very frustrating in that the curriculum for YM, YW, SS and even Primary call for multimedia content almost every week.


I think many of us are, or will be running into similar issues as we attempt to make shared resources on our networks available to our members. It would be great if when a GSC tech adds a new subnet to a meetinghouse network, the procedure would also include the adding of static routes between the existing subnet(s) and the new one. Perhaps they are already doing this. I guess you'll find out if you can access your server by IP address from a different subnet.

If not, and if the hardware configuration and OS on your media server permit, you might consider installing a NIC for each subnet. Set the IP for each NIC to one of the IPs in the static range for the its corresponding subnet. Devices on any of the subnets should then be able to reach the media server, hopefully by host name.

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Mikerowaved
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Re: Multicast on Meetinghouse network

Postby Mikerowaved » Tue Mar 05, 2013 7:56 pm

danpass wrote:It would be great if when a GSC tech adds a new subnet to a meetinghouse network, the procedure would also include the adding of static routes between the existing subnet(s) and the new one. Perhaps they are already doing this.

I tested this at my stake center and found our 881W was configured with a bridge between each disjointed subnet, so a static IP solution should work.
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Re: Multicast on Meetinghouse network

Postby ryan8382 » Tue Mar 05, 2013 8:17 pm

It is kind of frustrating how slow everything goes with all this. I have never been in the stake technology callings but have helped with the process and troubleshooting. I ran the first cables a year before they connected any of the cables. I have to say whoever finished at our stake did a really bad and not professional job. Enough with the rant.

Because it seems that everyone is going to pinch the bandwidth it seems to me that every stake and ward building are going to need to have the media files local. They are going to need some sort of NAS on-site. I think there should either be a calling at the stake level or church headquarters that handles the media organization and then everyone under them would get the sync every night. Playback could be something like XBMC on Raspberri Pi, i have seen that people have airplay working on it. I have recently started using Plex and can say that is very powerful and has great mobile device integration.

http://www.synology.com/products/produc ... 2B&lang=us
http://www.raspbmc.com/

Every site should be setup the same way with the same network setup.

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Re: Multicast on Meetinghouse network

Postby russellhltn » Tue Mar 05, 2013 9:35 pm

ryan8382 wrote:Because it seems that everyone is going to pinch the bandwidth it seems to me that every stake and ward building are going to need to have the media files local.


But the question is: is local to the meetinghouse good enough - or will network (perhaps wireless) problems mean this needs to be local to the device?
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moberle
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Re: Multicast on Meetinghouse network

Postby moberle » Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:30 am

How about starting with something simpler like understanding how multicast works? It also helps to understand the difference between unicast, multicast, broadcast, and anycast from the network infrastructure perspective.

Assuming it could be configured and allowed the local multicast support will depend almost entirely on the local network's ability to manage the groups. A standard solution makes more sense than having hundreds of different configurations depending on which media services a ward or stake building uses.

Understand; multicast is not confined to one subnet or interface on a given router or switch. Replication of network traffic is a function of multicast. Whether or not it works is a matter of how well your device (AppleTV, Media Server, etc) understands multicast and whether it can work with the network to manage the groups.

The approach that makes sense is for us to have a conversation here. If we treat some of these forums as engineering forums (not unlike the IETF approach) we can develop a set of requirements then present them to church IT for implementation.

An endless stream of non-unified solutions will only keep them hopping and never reaching a standardized solution.

Someone will always be dissatisfied with the final solution but as long as it adheres to known engineering standards then it becomes a matter of adapting the service to work in a standards based network environment instead of a hodge-podge of local configurations.

The analogy is simple. All roadgoing vehicles have wheels, motive power, and braking. Regardless of appearance, speed, power, etc, they roll on the road the same way; where the rubber hits the road, as it were. We keep our roads (network) uniform and allow vehicles (applications and services) to use them in the same manner then a solution is possible.

-Mike O

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Re: Multicast on Meetinghouse network

Postby ryan8382 » Sun Mar 10, 2013 5:36 pm

russellhltn wrote:
ryan8382 wrote:Because it seems that everyone is going to pinch the bandwidth it seems to me that every stake and ward building are going to need to have the media files local.


But the question is: is local to the meetinghouse good enough - or will network (perhaps wireless) problems mean this needs to be local to the device?


I would say that local to the building would be fine. We have no more than 8 places that would need to stream content. XBMC and Plex can buffer. I would probably say a 5 Disk system would be a good idea if there are going to be a lot of active streams.

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Re: Multicast on Meetinghouse network

Postby ryan8382 » Sun Mar 10, 2013 5:47 pm

moberle wrote:How about starting with something simpler like understanding how multicast works? It also helps to understand the difference between unicast, multicast, broadcast, and anycast from the network infrastructure perspective.

Assuming it could be configured and allowed the local multicast support will depend almost entirely on the local network's ability to manage the groups. A standard solution makes more sense than having hundreds of different configurations depending on which media services a ward or stake building uses.

Understand; multicast is not confined to one subnet or interface on a given router or switch. Replication of network traffic is a function of multicast. Whether or not it works is a matter of how well your device (AppleTV, Media Server, etc) understands multicast and whether it can work with the network to manage the groups.

The approach that makes sense is for us to have a conversation here. If we treat some of these forums as engineering forums (not unlike the IETF approach) we can develop a set of requirements then present them to church IT for implementation.

An endless stream of non-unified solutions will only keep them hopping and never reaching a standardized solution.

Someone will always be dissatisfied with the final solution but as long as it adheres to known engineering standards then it becomes a matter of adapting the service to work in a standards based network environment instead of a hodge-podge of local configurations.

The analogy is simple. All roadgoing vehicles have wheels, motive power, and braking. Regardless of appearance, speed, power, etc, they roll on the road the same way; where the rubber hits the road, as it were. We keep our roads (network) uniform and allow vehicles (applications and services) to use them in the same manner then a solution is possible.

-Mike O


Mike,

I do agree with you on what you said. The Apple/Multicast thing would be nice a great feature. It doesn't need to be used. If they have the media hosted on a NAS and use Plex/XBMC or something similar then showing it off a tablet isn't really necessary. I will say AppleTV's are not a viable option because they can't play content directly off a NAS.

Is there a group or forum that i should reading that talks about the media streaming topic? I have used many different media streamers in house thus far Plex is my favorite.


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