Tithing refund

[ecotim]

My first posting was based on me calling CHQ about something close to this and the suggestion to move it to fast offerings so that the Bishop could offer help more freely.

But what is the main role of the finance clerk? I see it as the eyes for the Bishopric. That person should be looking at anomalies. Warning signs and helpsfor families, especially those with missionaries in the field. If I saw onemember of a family submit a tithing check and then a different member of thesame family I would have questioned it, especially if that was not the trend.When I was finance clerk I saw the family patterns and this would have alertedme, maybe a phone call asking if they meant to pay twice.

But then that pings on magnifying your calling, what you feel your callingentails and what you think you should be doing. Are you the safeguard or just a check processor?

[nbflint]

When I was finance clerk I saw the family patterns and this would have alertedme, maybe a phone call asking if they meant to pay twice.

But then that pings on magnifying your calling, what you feel your callingentails and what you think you should be doing. Are you the safeguard or just a check processor?[/SIZE][/font]

This begs an interpretation of when a donation is made. Is the donation made when the envelope is turned over to the bishopric, when the deposit envelope is sealed, or when the drop is made at the bank? At what point does a donation become "non-refundable?"

I wouldn't call about a double donation. It is none of my business if the family had extra income, wanted to pay more tithing, is trying to get ahead a month or what ever reason. How much tithing a family pays is between them and the Lord, with the Bishop as an intermediary.

As a clerk, when I sit down to process donations my job is to record the donations correctly and get them to the bank. I would never call a family and ask if they wanted me to return a donation. How would you account for that? While this situation creates additional work it also creates an audit trail to protect all parties involved. Process the donations, make the bank drop, and call CHQ for additional help if needed.

[kisaac]

At what point does a donation become "non-refundable?"

I know what CHQ said to us, and I'd say you'd better call your stake and CHQ BEFORE you proceed with any ideas. Yes, true mistakes are true mistakes, but there is also the potential for fraud...giving an amount now, generating the "paper trail" with canceled checks, bank statements and donation slips, receipts, year-end or monthly donation summaries, and then asking for a refund later, which doesn't generate any trail- ESPECIALLY if a well-meaning clerk "hid" it.

Fraud hopefully is very rare within the church, but must be guarded for vigilantly by every unit throughout the church, and you don't want to seem a part of any of it by changing things...

We must always be above reproach, to "avoid the very appearance of evil." Every unit must work to ensure the integrity of the donation system, from the moment the envelope is sealed by the giver, so that the tax documents we all need to report to government agencies remain without question, as they are now. If we lose the perceived integrity of these documents in the eyes of the outside world, we will all suffer. That's why CHQ has these policies.

Call you stake. Let them send it up the ladder...

[kisaac]

if a well-meaning clerk...

Wow! sorry about my post. I didn't mean to sound grumpy or accusatory about any of us trying to help out...

I should have said: "be careful. don't do anything you'll have to answer for later to stake auditors, your file leaders, CHQ or the government."

Finance and donation laws are specific, and nobody wants to get caught in doing something "nice," but wrong.

[funaddict]

We had a similar situation last year where a member was distracted while filling out their donation slip and check and wrote a tithing check for 100% of their monthly income instead of 10%. They contacted the bishop the next day and he contacted CHQ and a few faxes later, he was told that the donation was being refunded and transferred into the "other" category and I was instructed to write them a refund check from that category.

[russellhltn]

and he contacted CHQ and a few faxes later,

As long as CHQ is in on it. I wouldn't want anyone do decide to do that on their own.

[gregwanderson]

I'm glad to hear that there can be a solution which 1) Doesn't involve Fast Offering funds, 2) Doesn't require a "lengthy" wait, 3) Doesn't involve tax lawyers, 4) Doesn't involve fraud charges, 5) Does involve the "Other" category and 6) Is approved (on a case-by-case basis) by Church Headquarters. Perhaps there was too much "drama" in the rest of our discussion.

[lajackson]

I'm glad to hear that there can be a solution which 1), 2), 3), 4), 5) and 6). Perhaps there was too much "drama" in the rest of our discussion.

Well, just as a matter of clarification, this is NOT the way Church Headquarters handled our problem two months ago, in which the situation was nearly identical. Nevertheless, the thing to do is still to call Hq and have them provide instructions.

[kisaac]

Well, just as a matter of clarification, this is NOT the way Church Headquarters handled our problem two months ago,

nor ours...

[pettyk12]

Is there a phone number to talk to someone about getting a refund for a donation?
My app told me three times my donation was rejected. It never asked for a confirmation. Everything looked like nothing was working. I should have stopped earlier. Upon checking my bank I found all three went through. So now I have paid 30% of my income to the church. Makes life a little tight to say the least.
This is entirely the fault of the church software. I have all the screen shots to support my claim.
Who can I call?