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RossEvans
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#101

Post by RossEvans »

tomw wrote:We can build importers from MLS into this system.

I don't follow that one. I thought the missing link under discussion -- just not all the way in the 1.0 plan yet -- is to go the other way: Push HT/VT data from this new system down to MLS.
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mkmurray
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#102

Post by mkmurray »

boomerbubba wrote:I don't follow that one. I thought the missing link under discussion -- just not all the way in the 1.0 plan yet -- is to go the other way: Push HT/VT data from this new system down to MLS.
Different issue:

Tom is talking about the initial entry of current assignments into the new system. Taking an MLS export of HT/VT and importing it into the new application to get a unit started using the new site, without manually re-entering everything.
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aebrown
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#103

Post by aebrown »

tomw wrote:
  • Initially STAKES will need to decide if all units in their stake will use the online system. Although stakes "could" mix -n- match MLS and HT/VT app, this would necessitate in double entry. For best results, all units in the stake should be on the same system.
  • We can build importers from MLS into this system.
What else am I missing?
The one thing that has been heavily discussed and is not in your summary is the ability to move data from HT/VT app to MLS. If we had an export from the HT/VT app, and an importer for MLS to allow that information to come into MLS, then it would:
  • eliminate the double entry you mentioned
  • make it easier (but probably still not advisable) for a stake to mix-n-match the two systems
  • allow wards to still use the integrated reports such as the Household Report and New Member Report without doube entry.
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mkmurray
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#104

Post by mkmurray »

Alan_Brown wrote:The one thing that has been heavily discussed and is not in your summary is the ability to move data from HT/VT app to MLS. If we had an export from the HT/VT app, and an importer for MLS to allow that information to come into MLS, then it would:
  • eliminate the double entry you mentioned
  • make it easier (but probably still not advisable) for a stake to mix-n-match the two systems
  • allow wards to still use the integrated reports such as the Household Report and New Member Report without doube entry.
Yes, but this solution still requires changes to MLS, correct? (Importing HT/VT data)

The best solution as proposed here and on the wiki was to have the MLS developers modify their code so that during Send/Receives, MLS calls a HT/VT web service that the Community exposes to other Church applications in order to download the latest HT/VT changes/updates from the new application. Tom W. mentioned he frequently talks with the PM over MLS and they are "on board" to integrate "when they are ready."

Further details are available in this very thread.
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#105

Post by RossEvans »

mkmurray wrote:Different issue:

Tom is talking about the initial entry of current assignments into the new system. Taking an MLS export of HT/VT and importing it into the new application to get a unit started using the new site, without manually re-entering everything.

Thanks. Now I get it.

Obviously the existing export files from MLS would not be up to this task.

If MLS developers are going to assist in that limited task, perhaps they could fix the existing HomeTeaching.csv and VisitingTeaching.csv export files for all of us while they are about it. (The problem is that these files lack unique ID fields for households and sisters being taught, and for the teachers and district supervisors.) That would kill two birds with one stone.
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aebrown
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#106

Post by aebrown »

mkmurray wrote:Yes, but this solution still requires changes to MLS, correct? (Importing HT/VT data)

The best solution as proposed here and on the wiki was to have the MLS developers modify their code so that during Send/Receives, MLS calls a HT/VT web service that the Community exposes to other Church applications in order to download the latest HT/VT changes/updates from the new application. Tom W. mentioned he frequently talks with the PM over MLS and they are "on board" to integrate "when they are ready."

Further details are available in this very thread.
I'm not hung up on the particular way the data is moved -- certainly something automatic would be more convenient than an Export/Import, but Export/Import is far better than nothing.

I am aware of the discussion on this thread -- I was responding to Tom's question regarding his summary: "What am I missing?"
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#107

Post by garysturn »

Alan_Brown wrote:The one thing that has been heavily discussed and is not in your summary is the ability to move data from HT/VT app to MLS. If we had an export from the HT/VT app, and an importer for MLS to allow that information to come into MLS, then it would:
  • eliminate the double entry you mentioned
  • make it easier (but probably still not advisable) for a stake to mix-n-match the two systems
  • allow wards to still use the integrated reports such as the Household Report and New Member Report without doube entry.
I think the discussion concluded that we would make the info available for MLS to draw from and that at some point in the future MLS might be altered to read that info. But since we have no way to change MLS that would have to be done by the Church.
tomw wrote:
What else am I missing?

Tom
The discussion also offered the possibility that we could create integrated reports by drawing on info that MLS did upload to create similar reports to those in MLS which included the HT/VT info from the new app. These could be downloaded or printed from the new app.
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RossEvans
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#108

Post by RossEvans »

GarysTurn wrote:I thought the discussion also offered the possibility that we could create integrated reports by drawing on info that MLS did upload to create similar reports which included HT/VT info. These could be downloaded or printed from the new app.

That's an interesting idea, but I don't think it is in the scope of the HT/VT app now. Either the scope would have to expand in 1.0 of the HT/VT app, or it would be a deferred item.

What you are describing is the beginning of this HT/VT app morphing into "MLS Web," but that is all quite futuristic as of now. That is my understanding.
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#109

Post by garysturn »

boomerbubba wrote:That's an interesting idea, but I don't think it is in the scope of the HT/VT app now. Either the scope would have to expand in 1.0 of the HT/VT app, or it would be a deferred item.

What you are describing is the beginning of this HT/VT app morphing into "MLS Web," but that is all quite futuristic as of now. That is my understanding.
I was only referring to creating Reports that include HT/VT info like a membership list with HT's listed, etc. I was not trying to imply that we would be able to recreate all MLS reports.
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aebrown
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#110

Post by aebrown »

GarysTurn wrote:I think the discussion concluded that we would make the info available for MLS to draw from and that at some point in the future MLS might be altered to read that info. But since we have no way to change MLS that would have to be done by the Church.

I thought the discussion also offered the possibility that we could create integrated reports by drawing on info that MLS did upload to create similar reports which included HT/VT info. These could be downloaded or printed from the new app.
Yes, there was a discussion along those lines, starting with this post. But I don't see how that works very welll. It would only work if a tremendous amount of detailed household and individual data were transferred from MLS to the HT/VT app. That seems impractical, and a poor segmentation of data if it were done. It's much more practical to move HT/VT data back to MLS, which is the natural and proper repository for household data.
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