API for Directory Web App

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JohnWWright
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Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:11 pm

Re: API for Directory Web App

#71

Post by JohnWWright »

I'm following the discussion about access to the "Public" Member Tools API.

Can we get permission to get "private" access to the Member Tools API?

I'm the Clerk in the Aspen Grove Branch and we have 90 new BYU students (45 men, 45 women) that we need to fill callings in the Branch each year. They are the Staff at Aspen Grove and it changes each year. It's quite a task for the Presidency of the Branch to organize interviews with all the new staff and make new callings.

We are using a Google Form created by BYU and our own database application for storing more information from each Student. We are using GroupMe to communicate with the Staff during the summer camp months.

I would like to simply connect our database to a Private Member Tools API, so when a student/staff changes their phone, picture, email, etc., it will change in our app as well.

Thanks, JohnW
John Wright
Aspen Grove Branch Clerk
801-221-1800
scgallafent
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Location: Riverton, Utah

Re: API for Directory Web App

#72

Post by scgallafent »

JohnWWright wrote:Can we get permission to get "private" access to the Member Tools API?
No.

There is a possibility that BYU OIT could sponsor a BYU project to do this and work with the Membership department to integrate membership data into that application, but there isn't a way that you can get access to any membership data APIs for a ward-sponsored project.
JohnWWright
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Re: API for Directory Web App

#73

Post by JohnWWright »

Ok, Thanks. I'll try that!
scgallafent
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Re: API for Directory Web App

#74

Post by scgallafent »

I sent some follow-up information by private message. For everyone else who might be wondering... It is possible that BYU might feel this is important to support Aspen Grove, but my personal opinion is that it isn't likely. Their IT teams are nice folks and they are also very busy taking care of the needs of the university. They don't have the staff to start building projects for BYU wards.

Short of an official project managed by the Church or an affiliated entity (BYU in the case of this request), there isn't a way to get access to membership data.
JohnWWright
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Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:11 pm

Re: API for Directory Web App

#75

Post by JohnWWright »

Ok, thanks. Just to clarify... We wouldn't need BYU to build a project. We have the Aspen Grove new member tools app built. BYU would just need to get access to the API, which could include the ability for the students to use their Member Tools username and password for SSO.

Also, my "day" job is building cool apps. We built the current "Tree of Life" Augmented Reality app for the Church last year that now has over 250,000 downloads.

We are modifying another note/crm/ticket/database app we are building, called Banna (www.banna.app), to use for the Aspen Grove Member Tools.
gisheri
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Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2021 1:43 pm

Re: API for Directory Web App

#76

Post by gisheri »

Okay, It took me more than an hour, but I just read over the past 4 years of posts on this thread regarding access to an api for LCR member data. There were a lot of references to policies, but no working links, so I'm not sure where to find some of these policies, and my questions weren't fully answered.

• Is there a policy barring me from creating some kind of chrome extension that can read the information in LCR (once the user has logged in) and present or organize it in different ways?
• Is there a policy barring me from publishing an LCR scraper on a scraper registry for members to use?
• Is there a policy preventing me from writing an application that a user provides a username/password which logs in in the user's behalf and reads the information to display it in helpful ways (without the user having to login themselves)?

None of these would be duplicating the information onto any kind of persistent storage. I suppose I generally view any information presented on a website as fair to view or organize according to the users's preferences, whether that's to just peruse, or copy notes into a notebook, or manually create reports with, or create automated filters, views, maps, etc with. If there's no policy barring someone from doing any of these things manually, then I'm assuming there wouldn't be one barring them from doing it automatically. In my mind that would be the equivalent of allowing someone to use pen and paper for their tasks, but not a mouse and keyboard. I'm not sure I understand where we're drawing the line.. or why. Is the issue with sending the information over the wire? It's already being sent over the wire to the user's browser.. which is just basically just a specific kind of 3rd party application that users are typing their usernames and passwords into.

How I'm hoping to utilize this is by combining LCR information with locally gathered information to help with:
- Better Mapping: Color coordination on status, callings, orgs, activity, age, interests, etc. Splitting wards into chunks, organizing members by ward area. Augmenting ward maps with non member info and non LCR info. organizing block activities, organizing fellowshipping assignments, etc.
- showing information gaps on ward members directory info, showing gaps in activity or visits,
- displaying timelines of events and visits to people of interest (similar to missionary's area book app), allowing members to keep a rolling record both ministering and non-ministering relevant events.
- keeping a kind of notification/visitation preferences list for weekly/monthly newsletters, invitations, visitations, etc.
- automated email/text reminders to leaders of certain reports (upcoming birthday visits, etc)
- creating custom views and reports for a variety of metrics, and automated task lists based on certain criteria

That's a start. I realize a lot of these utilizations could have privacy concerns if treated improperly, just like any of the manual data entry that leaders do on a daily basis. (a lot of these would probably reduce the amount of data that member leaders pass around like candy). I'm just trying to understand if there's a policy laying out specifically what I'm not allowed to do, beyond not storing PII. So many of my meetings are spent conveying information that could have been conveyed automatically given the software to do so. Or manually gathering reports that could have been manually automatically. The church has done a great job over the past few years giving us what we have in LCR, but there are a ton of very smart engineers in this church that have seen what good software can do that are just chomping at the bit to build better tools.
russellhltn
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Location: U.S.

Re: API for Directory Web App

#77

Post by russellhltn »

gisheri wrote: Mon Dec 13, 2021 5:41 pm There were a lot of references to policies, but no working links, so I'm not sure where to find some of these policies,
Links change over time. You might want to review the Terms of Use found at the bottom of each webpage.
You further agree not to: (i) use any robot, spider, or other automatic device, process, or means to access this site for any purpose, including, without limitation, for monitoring or copying any of the material on this site; (ii) use any manual process to monitor or copy any material on this site, or for any other purpose not expressly authorized in this Agreement, without our prior written consent;
Have you searched the Help Center? Try doing a Google search and adding "site:churchofjesuschrist.org/help" to the search criteria.

So we can better help you, please edit your Profile to include your general location.
russellhltn
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Joined: Sat Jan 20, 2007 2:53 pm
Location: U.S.

Re: API for Directory Web App

#78

Post by russellhltn »

Updated link for Keeping Church Information Safe

Meetinghouse Policy has been replaced by Technology Standards
Have you searched the Help Center? Try doing a Google search and adding "site:churchofjesuschrist.org/help" to the search criteria.

So we can better help you, please edit your Profile to include your general location.
scgallafent
Church Employee
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Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2009 4:55 pm
Location: Riverton, Utah

Re: API for Directory Web App

#79

Post by scgallafent »

gisheri wrote: Mon Dec 13, 2021 5:41 pm • Is there a policy barring me from creating some kind of chrome extension that can read the information in LCR (once the user has logged in) and present or organize it in different ways?
• Is there a policy barring me from publishing an LCR scraper on a scraper registry for members to use?
• Is there a policy preventing me from writing an application that a user provides a username/password which logs in in the user's behalf and reads the information to display it in helpful ways (without the user having to login themselves)?
The first two will get noticed by Security. The last one WILL earn you a phone call from Security. In some cases, a user's access to applications has been completely blocked due to their use of the APIs.

Church application APIs are not public APIs intended for external developers to use to build their own applications. russellhltn has already provided the relevant links. If you have further questions, you can contact the Church Data Privacy Office at dataprivacyofficer@ldschurch.org.
lukeh
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Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2018 1:40 pm

Re: API for Directory Web App

#80

Post by lukeh »

I have pushed back on these policies hard many times over the years, including publishing information in this forum detailing how to get the information over the JSON API that is used by the Church's own website (rather than having to scrape it). All my posts have been deleted by moderators, and a couple of moderators told me that my posts resulted in some vigorous internal discussions -- so even the moderators are not fully aligned with church policies on this, but they abide by those policies. I have been threatened with having the Church's lawyers sic'd on me several times. I gave up in the end.

I don't understand the policies. I think that they are unreasonable, and out of touch with the leakiness of the data access already granted on Church properties (e.g. you can easily copy/paste information out of your browser view of the ward list). These policies about API access actively impede our ability to fulfill and magnify our callings, or to use our initiative to do good things (D&C 58:26-28).

Moderators: PLEASE DO NOT DELETE THIS POST. People need to know that if they try to go down this road, they will fail, just like I did.
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