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Re: Class And Quorum Attendance

Posted: Sun Mar 07, 2021 4:27 pm
by BrianEdwards
When will our youth leaders have this capability?
As this is a user forum, nobody here is likely to know anything about whether this is "by design" (i.e. the communication was incorrect but the implementation is as intended), or "an omission" (the communication was correct but the implementation is wrong). Although I do think all of us, like you, wish it was implemented the way the communication says...

You can try the Feedback mechanism, but absent that, we're all in the same boat, and it seems like the adult leaders of the youth need to enter the info.

Re: Class And Quorum Attendance

Posted: Sun Mar 07, 2021 6:26 pm
by jdlessley
bkn2 wrote:The announcement indicated that organization and quorum presidencies and secretaries would be able to have this as part of Tools. None of our young women class presidencies or aaronic priesthood presidencies or secretaries have this option. When will our youth leaders have this capability?
The difficulty, or confusion, is the definition of organization. I also suspect that for the Aaronic Priesthood the reference was to the Presidency of the Aaronic Priesthood. I get this when I go to Leader and Clerk Resources and look to see what is listed under Organizations. What I see there is what I suspect is what was meant by organizations and quorums for the business rules as it applies to attendance report access. Therefore for the Young Women organization the business rules could mean the YW presidency and the YW classes are sub-organizations. For the Aaronic Priesthood Quorums the business rules could mean the Presidency of the Aaronic Priesthood, which is the bishopric. The three Aaronic Priesthood Quorums are under the Presidency of the Aaronic Priesthood. This is just my thought on why the youth do not have access.

Re: Class And Quorum Attendance

Posted: Sun Mar 07, 2021 7:18 pm
by russellhltn
jdlessley wrote:Therefore for the Young Women organization the business rules could mean the YW presidency and the YW classes are sub-organizations. For the Aaronic Priesthood Quorums the business rules could mean the Presidency of the Aaronic Priesthood, which is the bishopric. The three Aaronic Priesthood Quorums are under the Presidency of the Aaronic Priesthood. This is just my thought on why the youth do not have access.
Interesting thought. I'm wondering if privacy laws might play a role as well. Looking at the handbook, the class presidents don't seem to be charged with responsibilities for individuals. Responsibilities for individuals seems to be the key to granting adults "leadership access" to information.

While I don't think roll-taking is that "private", it would require that the person marking the rolls have the ability to see all the members, including the ones that had been marked "leadership only". Thus, they'd need some kind of leadership access to do their job.

The adult leaders are part of the ward council which does have responsibilities for individual so they are considered "leaders".

That's my speculative 2¢.

Re: Class And Quorum Attendance

Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 5:44 pm
by chriswoodut
bkn2 wrote:The announcement indicated that organization and quorum presidencies and secretaries would be able to have this as part of Tools. None of our young women class presidencies or aaronic priesthood presidencies or secretaries have this option. When will our youth leaders have this capability?
In the app, you can click help and then 'contact us' to provide feedback. I've done so as the current approach is problematic as you have indicated.

Re: Class And Quorum Attendance

Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 5:48 pm
by chriswoodut
russellhltn wrote:
jdlessley wrote:Therefore for the Young Women organization the business rules could mean the YW presidency and the YW classes are sub-organizations. For the Aaronic Priesthood Quorums the business rules could mean the Presidency of the Aaronic Priesthood, which is the bishopric. The three Aaronic Priesthood Quorums are under the Presidency of the Aaronic Priesthood. This is just my thought on why the youth do not have access.
Interesting thought. I'm wondering if privacy laws might play a role as well. Looking at the handbook, the class presidents don't seem to be charged with responsibilities for individuals. Responsibilities for individuals seems to be the key to granting adults "leadership access" to information.

While I don't think roll-taking is that "private", it would require that the person marking the rolls have the ability to see all the members, including the ones that had been marked "leadership only". Thus, they'd need some kind of leadership access to do their job.
There's no reason they can't program it so that the youth only see their class/quorum and the list of names with dates to check. We already provide this information to them on paper rolls, so I'm not sure how doing so electronically would be problematic. I know my wife as RS secretary only sees the RS and not the youth and EQ when looking at attendance.

Re: Class And Quorum Attendance

Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 5:53 pm
by russellhltn
chriswoodut wrote:There's no reason they can't program it so that the youth only see their class/quorum and the list of names with dates to check. We already provide this information to them on paper rolls, so I'm not sure how doing so electronically would be problematic.
It depends on how privacy laws are written. I think most were focused on electronic sharing, so it may not cover paper. I do know enough that in the business world, paper does play by different rules than computer systems.

Re: Class And Quorum Attendance

Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 5:55 pm
by chriswoodut
russellhltn wrote:
chriswoodut wrote:There's no reason they can't program it so that the youth only see their class/quorum and the list of names with dates to check. We already provide this information to them on paper rolls, so I'm not sure how doing so electronically would be problematic.
It depends on how privacy laws are written. I think most were focused on electronic sharing, so it may not cover paper. I do know enough that in the business world, paper does play by different rules than computer systems.
But that's just supposition, it could be a lot of things we don't know.

Re: Class And Quorum Attendance

Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 6:29 pm
by russellhltn
chriswoodut wrote:But that's just supposition, it could be a lot of things we don't know.
True. It would certainly be nice to get clear instructions of what we can expect going forward.

Re: Class And Quorum Attendance

Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:39 pm
by LavaPhoenix
My ward starting using this feature about a month ago. When they record attendance for a Sunday for any of the quorums/classes, the attendance moves to a different Sunday and is no longer correct. The organizations have corrected this multiple times and the attendance keeps moving to different Sundays. I am not sure if it takes until the next Sunday for it to move or happens sooner than that. Is anyone else experiencing the same issue? I want to submit a bug about this, but am not sure the best way to go about that. If anyone knows the best way to report this, if they could please let me know.

Re: Class And Quorum Attendance

Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2021 10:25 pm
by john.allred
Primary is the problem we have with the new attendance tools. All of our primary classes take place over individual zoom calls. But our teachers do not have the ability to take attendance. I’m trying to think through the reasons why the people who know the information would not have the ability to enter the information. I suppose one reason is that primary teachers are not set apart to a specific class, but it wouldn’t be too hard for the developers to allow the primary presidency to assign teachers to a specific class and then only allow them to do attendance for that class.