Kindoo Access Control System

[waymana]

We have been told that there will initially be
50 licenses allocated to the Stake,
20 licenses allocated to each Ward,
we have not been able to get an answer if there are additional licenses allocated for branch leadership. We have two branches in our Stake.
Does anyone know if additional licenses are allocated for branches?

It is 20 licenses for each ward or branch. All the licenses are aggregated at the stake level for the buildings in the stake. A stake with 5 wards or branches would receive 150 licenses. So if a branch or ward doesn't need as many licenses, others in the stake could use them.

[nathangg]

This thread has been wonderful. Thank you (especially to @swigginton for many initial detailed answers).

Perhaps it is because I know @greenwoodkl (we went to college together!) or maybe we just think alike, but I have some of the same thought processes and concerns.

Specifically, in my scenario, I'm in a supporting role to the bishopric, but not one of the callings that our stake will give access to. This is already causing some concern because as recently as 8 days ago I was asked to go over to the clerks office to help do an emergency fast offering check (it was a Saturday). In the future, I won't be able to do that. (Note that I want to be available on an emergency basis to do a check, but I do feel that by spreading the workload out I'm able to administer more so my ecclesiastical leaders can focus on ministering).

Unless: it appears that I can be persistent access for the duration of my calling, then that access can be removed when I'm released, right?

Note: this would not be a stake-wide thing since the stake probably doesn't want to automatically give finance clerks or assistant clerks access when they don't need it. But in my case, I'm the one that has been given primary responsibility for checks, but I'm going to be unable to help prep a check in the same way we've been doing it.

Another question: the stake mentioned that accompanists are going to be given default access (to practice the organ). But what if only one accompanist uses it? Will the stake be able to remove the default access for all accompanists and just let the one that uses it be given access? It feels like stakes have to tell the FM group which callings to auto-sync. Does this mean that to remove "accompanist" from auto-syncing the stake will have to tell the FM group, and then the FM group will update the configuration, and then the licenses will be freed up?

[waymana]

Unless: it appears that I can be persistent access for the duration of my calling, then that access can be removed when I'm released, right?
----

Another question: the stake mentioned that accompanists are going to be given default access (to practice the organ). But what if only one accompanist uses it? Will the stake be able to remove the default access for all accompanists and just let the one that uses it be given access? It feels like stakes have to tell the FM group which callings to auto-sync. Does this mean that to remove "accompanist" from auto-syncing the stake will have to tell the FM group, and then the FM group will update the configuration, and then the licenses will be freed up?

Yes the calling list is customizable. The stake should let the FM group know which callings that they want synchronized with LCR for automatic access. They should have received a spreadsheet template to send to the FM group. The FM group can also provide a report based on the list provided of who will receive access once the synchronization is turned on.

Callings where not everyone in the calling needs access can be handled either by not synchronizing that calling and granting access manually or by synchronizing and then removing the people that don't need access. If you are having to remove people from Kindoo after they are added automatically it may be easier to not have that calling synchronized and the stake Kindoo manager can add those individuals as requested. So this would apply for both of your situations, you or the accompanists could request access for the duration of your calling and the stake Manager could keep track of those individuals separately. It maybe best to communicate the callings that are approved that can receive access upon request but will not receive automatic access.

[rknelson]

Another question: the stake mentioned that accompanists are going to be given default access (to practice the organ). But what if only one accompanist uses it? Will the stake be able to remove the default access for all accompanists and just let the one that uses it be given access? It feels like stakes have to tell the FM group which callings to auto-sync. Does this mean that to remove "accompanist" from auto-syncing the stake will have to tell the FM group, and then the FM group will update the configuration, and then the licenses will be freed up?

The interface software ("Sentry") add/removes users as changes are entered in LCR. FM is able to customize the list of callings that receive automatic access under the direction of each stake. It is not a ward specific list. When a person is added to a calling in LCR on the approved list they will receive access automatically and the person being released will have their access removed. Other individuals will need to be given access manually by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager. If someone in an approved calling does not need building access, they will need to be removed by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager in the Kindoo app after they have been assigned. The unused license goes back into the stake pool and can be reassigned to another calling. The software also integrates Church building data with Kindoo, so it will grant building access to the member’s home meetinghouse. There might also be some manual edits by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager for access to additional buildings. The user license is connected to the stake, so adding a building to a user does not affect the number of licenses.

Automation reduces the effort required by taking care of most but not all changes. I welcome the automation - it is quite a task to keep up with all the changes. In our stake we have a list of callings that are automated and a list of callings that need to be added manually as the Stake President or Bishop (or whoever they delegate) requests them. If you automate all the callings across every ward where they want that calling to have access you will run out of licenses, but many of them would never be used (for example the Organist needs to be able practice but is that person called as the Accompanist, Music Director, Music Leader, or Organist - we have some of each of these with current Kindoo access in our units). This does not to imply the non-automated callings are less in need of building access, just that they need some manual entry.

In my experience this system really does work well, and I only wish we could add Stake/Bishops/Clerks offices and the Library to Kindoo then we could dispense with a bunch of expensive ASSA keys. The cost would be for the Kin and door latch hardware, but it really would not require more licenses.

[ELHawkes]

The interface software ("Sentry") add/removes users as changes are entered in LCR. FM is able to customize the list of callings that receive automatic access under the direction of each stake. It is not a ward specific list. When a person is added to a calling in LCR on the approved list they will receive access automatically and the person being released will have their access removed. Other individuals will need to be given access manually by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager. If someone in an approved calling does not need building access, they will need to be removed by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager in the Kindoo app after they have been assigned. The unused license goes back into the stake pool and can be reassigned to another calling. The software also integrates Church building data with Kindoo, so it will grant building access to the member’s home meetinghouse. There might also be some manual edits by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager for access to additional buildings. The user license is connected to the stake, so adding a building to a user does not affect the number of licenses.

Our FM has told us that they will be installing the Kindoo system in our Stake in the next week or two based on getting it scheduled with the installer. We have asked if we will get any prior access to the system so that we can learn and get familiar with managing the system, but from the response from the FM, access won't be granted until the day the system is installed. The FM asked us to chose which Stake and Ward callings to have Synced, which we did, but has never provided any type of spreadsheet.
The only advanced training provided is to simply read the instructions on this wiki website page, https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions
After reading all of the instructions, I was lead to believe that all of the callings that are Synced and get automatic access used up a licence whether the user used it or not. The information in the quote above that is bolded and underlined, is not explained in the online wiki instructions, so that is nice to know that a user can be removed even if they are in a calling that gets automatic access via a calling that is synced if they don't want or need access, so that licences can be reallocated and not wasted. Maybe someone can update the wiki to make that more clear.

[nathangg]

The interface software ("Sentry") add/removes users as changes are entered in LCR. FM is able to customize the list of callings that receive automatic access under the direction of each stake. It is not a ward specific list. When a person is added to a calling in LCR on the approved list they will receive access automatically and the person being released will have their access removed. Other individuals will need to be given access manually by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager. If someone in an approved calling does not need building access, they will need to be removed by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager in the Kindoo app after they have been assigned. The unused license goes back into the stake pool and can be reassigned to another calling. The software also integrates Church building data with Kindoo, so it will grant building access to the member’s home meetinghouse. There might also be some manual edits by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager for access to additional buildings. The user license is connected to the stake, so adding a building to a user does not affect the number of licenses.

After reading all of the instructions, I was lead to believe that all of the callings that are Synced and get automatic access used up a licence whether the user used it or not. The information in the quote above that is bolded and underlined, is not explained in the online wiki instructions, so that is nice to know that a user can be removed even if they are in a calling that gets automatic access via a calling that is synced if they don't want or need access, so that licences can be reallocated and not wasted. Maybe someone can update the wiki to make that more clear.

I agree with @ELHawkes (and I've bolded the sentence that stood out to me as important).

I'm at the ward level and am starting out with my access being revoked. The impression I got from the Stake Kindoo Key Manager was that there was nothing that could be done, however, upon reading this entire thread and the https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions instructions, it seems that my stake is still learning how all of this works (which is normal: we haven't implemented it yet so it is new to all of us).

I think for now I'm going to let things soak in, but I am working to provide accurate information back up to the Stake Kindoo Key Manager and my bishop so that the knowledge spreads around about how the system supports various needs (instead of being told "Only 14 people at the ward level get a persistent key and everyone else has to submit a google form for a one-time use key request" (they didn't send those words exactly, but that is the impression that is being conveyed)). It seems that after the initial rollout we can review with the Stake Kindoo Manager who in our ward is using the access and adjust things as needed.

I'm excited that the system is more flexible than I originally thought.

Thank you to everyone for helping increase understanding on how this works!

[mmacconnell]

Kindoo is an approved app for our Missionaries and they have been using it for about a year now.

Our problem is the number of licenses. We only have 5 left which I keeping for temp users. Before the integration I could just ask the FM group for more. Now that we are integrated we have hit a wall getting more licenses. Plus we have a couple of people that are non-members that were approved to access our Family Search Center and no one is sure how we give them Kindoo access short of a temp license which is a pain to manage.

The thing I have found helpful is setting up Access Roles. I can give Bishoprics and the PFF’s 24/7 access but give others limited hours that would fit what their calling needs.

[russellhltn]

Plus we have a couple of people that are non-members that were approved to access our Family Search Center and no one is sure how we give them Kindoo access short of a temp license which is a pain to manage.

At one time the Operations Guide said non-members couldn't have keys to the FHS. Currently, all I can find in there is: "At least two staff members must be present when the center is open to the public and is the only activity going on in the building. If other activities or meetings are being conducted in the building, one staff member is sufficient."

General Handbook 35.5.3 says "Keys to the building should be given only to designated ward or stake members."

Trying to get keys to non-members is going to be an issue since things go back to the membership record - and they have none. There's nothing to tie their account to any area, much less a building. Given the policy, I don't know as there's going to be any fix forthcoming.

[waymana]

Thank you for your comments. The Stake Kindoo Manager Instructions have been updated with additional information about the calling synchronization. https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions. We have updated other materials for FMs but hadn't updated these materials.

[ELHawkes]

Thank you for your comments. The Stake Kindoo Manager Instructions have been updated with additional information about the calling synchronization. https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions. We have updated other materials for FMs but hadn't updated these materials.

Thanks for the updates, this new sentence is very helpful. "The stake can also choose to synchronize access with a calling and then afterwards remove the access for a specific individual."

Our FM contacted us today and we will be getting Kindoo installed Wed this week.
He also provided a list of the callings we chose to sync with LCR, but there was not an option in Sentry to sync the "Stake Technology Specialist" but there was an option for "Stake building Specialist", a calling we didn't know existed.
I don't know if it is possible to get access to the management part of Kindoo prior to having it installed, but we have not received access yet. I find that very frustrating having to go into a new system mostly blind until it is installed and the entire stake loses their electronic access from our current Sicunet system all on the day they switch us to Kindoo. Hopefully that can be better coordinated with other Stakes and some type of training into managing the actual management interface, in the future.